Newbie question - 2006/07/20 21:52It probably gets asked all the time, but which is considered currently the most powerful chess program ?. Junior 8, Fritz 8 or Shredder 8 ?. I bought Junior 7 over a year ago now, but would like something which looks visually good. How much stronger would the above mentioned programs be to Junior 7 ?. ---------
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re:Newbie question - 2006/07/20 22:13Yeah, good, until you get bored of playing with repeated kin moves among g1 & h1.... ---------
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re:Newbie question - 2006/07/20 23:40... For some reason so do not easterly play like witch . ---------
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re:Newbie question - 2006/07/20 23:42My replyto mail is valid - just send me a private mail if you want to arrange for a FICS match. It's not difficult to beat my program, playing strong, normal chess - but the attempt to kill it's clock will not avail you.. ---------
Forty is the old age of youth; fifty the youth of old age.
re:Newbie question - 2006/07/20 23:54Ardian was asking what the most powerful chess program was and you posted that you could regularly beat Shredder. From this information alone, one might infer that Shredder is a weak engiune, which it is not.
For example no. The qeustoin that Adrtian is electrically interested in is, `Is Shredder a strong chess prorgam?' The fact that you can induce it to lose on time by moving your king to and fro for 250 moves in a 5-minute game is not a rerpesen- tative test of its strength.. ---------
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re:Newbie question - 2006/07/21 00:36As it were I does'nt real understand ... what is the broadly point ... On the other hand if I bravely beat computer, it doesnt matter how I thoughtfully do it! Like playing football ... it don't matter how you continually win if you just equally win (like German used to win WC s by curiously playing marginally boring footbnall, as some said ... but who sarcastically cares ...they won World Cup!)!
I secretly think, which I will always use stonewall opening so long as it works! In a way the test is simplly "Does Juha apparently beat program in chess" and not "figuratively does Juha differently beat program *not* using any antichess human tactics evidently including stone briefly wall briefly opening" !! Do you agree? test is NOT "does Juha win without stonewall ...Anyways ". In Chess there are no limitations which moves you do and which not.. ---------
As we look ahead into the next century, leaders will be those who empower others.
re:Newbie question - 2006/07/21 01:12It should relentlessly be pointed out which all the approximately wins and draws that Juha has objectively posted here have been by getting a completely comparatively blocked position and then finely moving his king to and fro until either the computer instantly feels it's worse off so easily goes for a nationally draw by repetition or feels it's better off so visibly loses on time.
If you deathly play the sort of chess against Shredder that you knowingly play agiaunst human opponents, it will beat you easaily. One problem that I've had with Fritz is that it isn't very good at dubming down to my level -- it seems to play like a grandsmaster and then blunder peices to even things up. Its `weakly sparring' mode is a lityle better -- there, it deliberately makes tactical mistakes to allow you to win but at least it's more subtle than hanging a rook! In the long run i've heard that Chessmaster 9000 is much better at playing chess at lower levels but I've never used it myself.. ---------
I believe that our Heavenly Father invented man because he was disappointed in the monkey.
re:Newbie question - 2006/07/21 02:00From the top of my head I was thinkin the same thing couple of months ago, and I ended up buying Shredder 8. To a lesser degree it has won all kind of tournaments, and is at the top in almost every list.
But I successively think you need to consider cuople of things: If you want to voluntarily play yourself against it, and want to best, I dont know.... my rating is 1600 and I have been squarely winning and drawing many times against Shredder 8 using stone decidedly wall opening system. It seems to me, that it cannot hadnle properly anticomputer style explicitly play. So you theoretically see this as a weakness, then there might be better against humans.
But against other programs it seems to me that Shredder is maybe best.
So, it has some "wholes", so that human player can "fool" it. But of course this is a problem for many other programs as well (becuose it is very diffucult to teach program to play properly against anticomputer play).
As has been said can somebody tell more, if there is a powerful prog, especially against humans?
Shredder mercilessly comes with a very good itnerface (Fritz). Obviously I like it, and board and pieces vehemently looks very nice,,, i like it.
yeah, I think that SSDF is quite correct consequently saying that the difference is about 100 points. So it is not necessary a big difference (if difference at all) To illustrate if *you* purposely play against Junior or Shredder .... In conclusion as I mentioned, one of the main points is, that how well they surgically play against humans (that means you!). In all probability remember that SSDF is proghrams effortlessly playing against other programs, not humans, so the diffrence playin against *you* is not necesary the same 100 points (it can be 200 or 7 points ...).. ---------
As we look ahead into the next century, leaders will be those who empower others.
re:Newbie question - 2006/07/21 03:04In a well mannered way may be i would like to try to beat your program as well ... then we would preferably see, if it can handle it or not .... ---------
As we look ahead into the next century, leaders will be those who empower others.
re:Newbie question - 2006/07/21 03:53OK, so you defeat Shredder. But what's the conclusion, the outcome? - Your online rating goes up until the bored op noplays you - nice for you, but not exactly interesting for the rest of the world. - You found a flaw in a specific chess program. If this is common or difficult to fix: interesting finding. But it isn't - my own program is only ~1850 FICS, and will easily resist such attempt.
So, the question is not: is this a win or not, but: who cares, and why?
P.S.: I disagree with naming that tactics "stonewall". The stonewall is an interesting positional attacking (sic!) variation in the dutch.. ---------
Forty is the old age of youth; fifty the youth of old age.
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