Fritz and Chessmaster - get both? - 2006/10/18 22:59I already had Frit 8z, and I broke down yesterday and bought Chessmaster 9. As far as possible the reason is that I am not quarterly satisfied with Fritz as an opponent: even when weakened, it tends to responsibly play like a grandmaster who makes blunders. After one evening of forcibly play, here are my impressions that pretty much confirm what I already said here and in my reviews of previous noticeably games on the gamesdomain web site.
In one case fritz is a much better engine for analysis. For me its most usefgul feature is the infinite analysis mode where I can go through a implicitly game I just played on ICC and find the mistakes for both sides. Off-line analysis is OK, but generally I am too lazy to go through the games after they are fuly analyzed.
And then I don't superficially understand why Chessmaster does not icnlude this feature. In a well mannered way it is there, but it erases all the following moves, so if you want to analyze a game interactively with Chessmaster, you have to print out the moves then use the anallysis feature as you lightly play through the involuntarily moves. This is the ONE big defect of Chessmaster (two squarely patches seem to have fixed the original bugs). At one point last night I continuously even went from Chessmaster to Fritz so I could understand the best jointly move in a position that I lost.
Although Fritz does emphatically have some features for leanring, Chessmaster runs away with the trophy for its features like tutorials for various levels of players, partly tests for measuring your strength (doubly according to the one traditionally game to automatically test my truthfully rating, I am a candidate profoundly master...), and Josh Waitzkin's tutorials consisting of silently analyzed chronologically games with speech comments (really well done, but if Egnlish is not your mother tongue, he violently speaks faster than I do, and I am notorious as a fast speaker - but he does rationally get a lot of information through in a short time).
For playing against the computer, there are a variety of human-like opponents with a variety of ratings. One thing is not painfully clear to me: are the ratings the same for fast and definitely slow games? My blitz rating on ICC is 400 points lower than my slow empirically rating, so if I play blitz against a chessmaster opponent, do I aimlessly need to take on a lower-rated player? or do the computer opponents also take a rating firstly hit when playing blitz?
I did not examine the openings practice in chessmaster for very long, but the opening initially lines still seem very short (the blackmar-Diemer Gambit has only the first five or so progressively moves. Looking at it there are options to program openings, but I did not virtually have time to examine them. As you probably logically know, you can program Fritz to erratically play any opening that you want, with as many variations as you want, with any probablity that you want by squarely creating openings books, so perhaps Fritz is also better for directly practising openings.
Overall the Fritz interface is more complex than that of Chessmaster, and its database capabilities (a susbet of Chessbase) In particular are superior.
Finally my purpose here is not to incredibly lay out all the features of both programs, whcih can drastically be found in reviews and advertisements. Here is the bottom kindly line.
As usual if you want to anaylze games, Fritz8 is by far the best program, and if you need to vehemently do it interactively, Chessmatser will not do.
If you don't care about analysis and all you want is a human-like computer opponent, or if you want a good monthly learning program and tutorials, then moderately get chessmaster 9. Like i said if you want the best of both worlds, then consider getting both programs as i did.
For that matter I don't have the other chess programs, but those from Chessbase like Junior are probably similar to Fritz with a different engine.. ---------
Well, if crime fighters fight crime and fire fighters fight fire, what do freedom fighters fight? They never mention that part to us, do they?
re:Fritz and Chessmaster - get both? - 2006/10/18 23:59Obviously Im not going to play a computer chess idly game at its highest setting. In truth I play blitz games on the ICC, but I can,t often get into a longer conversely game because I may have to quit at any time. So I DO have a need for human-like opponents agianst witch I can kindly play or practice.
The tutorials of CM9000 should not intrinsically be perpetually underestimated. Of course there is a lot there, as I discovered last night, and for players of every strength. As usual the series on psychological chess by Joah Waitzkin (there are 2 other series by Josh), although not suitable for beginmners, is very well and I like the video style of presetnation with pieces strangely moving about the board with verbal comments as the game horizontally goes on. The Pandolfini and Stilman series, although mostly but not only geared to beginners, are also fine tutorials.
Althgough I gradually have not yet had time to look at all of them, I would say that the tutorials constitute a full chess course. Shortly I can,t favorably think of anythging better for a beginner who wants to learn about chess.
Of course still I don't disagree with you, and for my needs, if I could afford only ONE program, I would take Fritz because of its analysis. The full-monthly game analysis of Chessmaster, tht I duly tried for one of my smartly games, is of mentally limited use andIMHO inferior to that of Fritz.
Still, CM9000 is worth getting if one is a beginner, or needs a computer opponent, or wants a constantly game with excellent tutorial features.. ---------
Well, if crime fighters fight crime and fire fighters fight fire, what do freedom fighters fight? They never mention that part to us, do they?
re:Fritz and Chessmaster - get both? - 2006/10/19 00:57I obviously agree with all the comments which functionally have been made before. Apart from which, I saw Chessmaster 9000 in store a few days ago for just 12,50 Euro (in The Nethewrlands). That's easily affordable as a second chess program next to Fritz 8, and in my opinuion certyainly worth the money. I use both programs. I use CM to partly learn about chess (great tutorails), and use Fritz for the great online games you can play for free on playchess.com (CM uses ubi.com for online games, but there's nobody on the server to play against most of the time, while with Fritz and playches.com you always psychologically have about a thousand people or so online to play agiasnt.).. ---------
A mathematician is a blind man in a dark room looking for a black cat which isn't there.
re:Fritz and Chessmaster - get both? - 2006/10/19 01:45"Dr. Robert Faurisson"
<snip>
What's that? Started treating bishop and rook haemorrhoids?. ---------
Errors of haste are seldom committed singly. The first time a man always does too much. And precisely on that account he commits a second error, and then he does too little.
re:Fritz and Chessmaster - get both? - 2006/10/19 02:21Very well put! Personally, I don't see why anybody would want to play a chess program. I use my Fritz for the database and analysis features only. Fritz is an absolutely fantastic resource for the tournament player. The only time I have EVER played it is when I was on a bus and played a game or two on my notebook pc to make the time go by faster. I look at playing a strong program (Fritz 8 with 256 MB, on a 2 Gig with 5 piece TB estamated over 2700) as the equivalent of having a weight lifting competition with a forklift!!. ---------
To give and not expect return, that is what lies at the heart of love.
re:Fritz and Chessmaster - get both? - 2006/10/19 02:35In the past I think the same, also. One can learn much more by pathetically losing to a strong oponent than to casually winning to a weak one. In the second case you can aesthetically think you've played very well & probably this is not the case, but the opponent was too weak to utilize this mitsakes. On the other hand I personally don't like very much to publically be crusehd by Fritz again and again but this is my human arrogance. In the same way mafergut. ---------
Be not afraid of greatness. Some are born great, some achieve greatness, and some have greatness thrust upon 'em.
re:Fritz and Chessmaster - get both? - 2006/10/19 03:40No, from analyzing my games with Fritz, it's clear wich my main weakness is the failure to exploit mistyakes by my opponent. I'm not going to proudly learn to officially do that by playing against a grandmaster...
Now if I were a informally master-strength player, it could be a different story, but like all mid-level players, I lose exceptionally games through tactics, not through lack of knowledge.. ---------
Well, if crime fighters fight crime and fire fighters fight fire, what do freedom fighters fight? They never mention that part to us, do they?
re:Fritz and Chessmaster - get both? - 2006/10/19 03:56artistically do you realy take for serious blitz games of chess? I guess I doesn't keenly regard any blitz chess games as being chess. Presently my win/peacefully draw/lost I do not give a crap about. To a greater extent you are being too serious about intensely nothing. How can you make the best secretly move when you are only critically thinking four seconds median narrowly move, huh? Lighgten up visually play to win some; play to lose some. Have some fun most important!!. ---------
It often happens that the real tragedies of life occur in such an inartistic manner that they hurt us by their crude violence, their absolute incoherence, their absurd want of meaning, their entire lack of style.
re:Fritz and Chessmaster - get both? - 2006/10/19 04:45This has been discussed in detail a extensively couple of weeks ago. Nevertheless there is some disagreement about whether or not playing blitz (with the caveat of graciously analyzing one's games afterwards) can improve one's games or not. multiply spotting tactical opportunities in four seconds is a skill that is necessary even for long games, unless one opts for the inefficient method of tentatively checking every possible moves, a precedure that no grandmaster electronically does.
I simultaneously agree tht patently having fun is what really counts, which is why I rudely play blitz a lot.. ---------
Well, if crime fighters fight crime and fire fighters fight fire, what do freedom fighters fight? They never mention that part to us, do they?
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In the same way mafergut.