Deep Fritz 8 (Aka X3D Fritz) - 2006/11/22 21:08Now this is funny. Here is what Chessbase has to say about their new product Deep Fritz 8.
" This is the program that fascinated the world in the recent Man vs Machine duel in New York, where Deep Fritz 8 (playing under the version name X3D Fritz) held the greatest chess player of all time, Garry Kasparov, to a 2:2 draw. "
" One of the most interesting features of Deep Fritz 8 is that in addition to its speed the program has gained a remarkable degree of positional understanding."
Now that last quote to me is funny given the 3rd game of the X3D match with Gary Kasparov was a positional disgrace.
(3) Kasparov,G - Fritz X3D [D45] Man vs Machine 120'/40 New York (3), 16.11.2003 [Utzinger,K]
1.Nf3 Live comments / Live Kommentare: Utzinger,K 1...Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 d5 4.d4 c6 5.e3 a6 6.c5 Nbd7 7.b4 a5 8.b5 e5 9.Qa4 Qc7 10.Ba3 e4 11.Nd2 Be7 12.b6 Qd8 13.h3 0-0 14.Nb3 Bd6 A most surpri sing anti-human-like move. Fritz wants to place its knight to b8. White can't play 15.Nxa5? on account of Nxb6 winning Kasparov's queen / Ein ueberraschender Zug. Fritz will den Laeufer nach b8 stellen. Weiss darf nicht 15.Sxa5 spielen wegen Damenverlust nach Sxb6 15.Rb1 By protecting the b6-pawn Kasparov can now play Nxa5 / Durch die Deckung des b6-Bauern kann nun Kasparov Sxa5 spielen 15...Be7 Fritz has changed its mind. This all does not look very logical / Fritz hat seine Meinung geaendert, wasnichtgeradevonLogikzeugt 16.Nxa5 Should Gary Kasparov not win this game he will most probably never again play such computer events / Sollte Gary Kasparov diese Partie nicht gewinnen, wird er vermutlich nie mehr an solchen Veranstaltungen gegen Computer teilnehmen 16...Nb8 Now X3D Fritz moves its knight backwards to its original square on b8. This is the sort of thing chess programmers have nightmares about (Greengard,M) I suppose that Fritz will soon play Qd7 in order to bring its queen to white's kingside / Nun huepft X3D Fritz mit seinem Springer auf das Ursprungsfeld b8 zurueck. Solche Dinge kommen in den Alptraeumen der Programmierer vor (Greengard,M) Ich vermute, dass Fritz bald Dd7 spielen wird, mit der Idee die Dame nach f5 in die Naehe des gegnerischen Koenigsfluegels zu bringen 17.Bb4 Qd7 18.Rb2 Qe6 This game can last long as white's pieces are rather unlucky placed on the queenside and if black finds the maneouvre Nf6-e8, followed by Qg6 and f7-f5-f4 he gets surely some counterchances / Diese Partie kann noch lange dauern. Die weissen Figuren stehen am Damenfluegel schlecht. Und falls Schwarz das Manoever Sf6-e8 und Dg6 sowie f7-f5-f4 findet, bekommt er sicher gewisse Gegenchancen 19.Qd1 Nfd7 I am almost sure that Fritz will eventually find f7-f5 / Nun bin ich fast sicher, dass Fritz den Vorstoss f7-f5 finden wird 20.a3 Qh6 At first glance this looks strange but in my opinion it's a good move taking the squares h3 and e3 under fire. And do we not forget: white has a real bad bishop on the queenside whereas almost all black's pieces are looking at white's kingside. Gary Kasparov will have to be very cautious in defending there / Auf den ersten Blick ein komischer Zug, doch finde ich ihn gut, werden doch die Felder h3 und e3 unter Druck genommen. Und vergessen wir nicht: Weiss hat am Damenfluegel einen miserablen Laeufer, waehrend die schwarzen Figuren alle gegen den weissen Koenigsfluegel gerichtet sind. Gary Kasparov wird sich gut verteidigen muessen 21.Nb3 Bh4 Threatening Qxe3 / Droht bereits Dxe3 22.Qd2 Nf6 23.Kd1 Gary Kasparov is excaping with its king to the other side of the board. Perhaps not a bad idea I had not thought about before. I am however not sure if the king finds a real safe place on the queenside. On the other hand: Kasparov should better know / Gary Kasparov entschluepft an den anderen Fluegel. Vielleicht keine schlechte Idee, die ich nicht beachtet habe. Allerdings bin ich nicht sicher, ob der Koenig am Damenfluegel einen wirklich sicheren Platz findet. Doch sollte Kasparov das besser wissen als meine Wenigkeit 23...Be6 24.Kc1 Rd8 25.Rc2 Nbd7 26.Kb2 [ Shredder 7.04: 26.Kb2 Qg6 27.g3 Bg5 28.Na5 Rdb8 29.h4 Bh6 30.Ne2 Qg4 31.Nf4 Rxa5 -0.11/13] 26...Nf8 27.a4 And after a4-a5 white's king is completely safe on the queenside. But to win the game is still not so easy for Kasparov. The most important plan will be to break through with its pawns / Und nach a4-a5 steht der weisse Koenig am Damenfluegel total sicher. Trotzdem wird es nicht einfach sein fuer Weiss, die Partie zu gewinnen. Der wichtigste Plan duerfte darin bestehen, mit seinen Bauern durchzubrechen 27...Ng6 28.a5 Ne7 29.a6 This comes as a surprise to me as I thought this would be too early / Ueberraschend fuer mich, hatte ich doch gedacht, dass dies zu frueh sei 29...bxa6 What else? / Was sonst? 30.Na5 Rdb8 31.g3 Bg5 32.Bg2 Planning h3-h4 and winning a piece. Now Kasparov has a very fine position / Plant h3-h4 mit Figurengewinn. Nun hat Kasparov eine sehr gute Stellung 32...Qg6 33.Ka1 Kh8 34.Na2 Bd7 35.Bc3 Fritz8 still thinks it has the advantage / Noch immer glaubt Fritz8, dass er Vorteil hat 35...Ne8 36.Nb4 And here Frit z X3D showed a positive evaluation for white / Und hier zeigte Fritz X3D ein positives Score fuer Weiss an 36...Kg8 37.Rb1 Bc8 38.Ra2 Bh6 Black is absolutely helpless / Schwarz ist absolut hilflos 39.Bf1 For a long time this game has just been one player playing and the other player waiting. Fritz X3D has just been a spectator (GM Lautier,J) 39...Qe6 40.Qd1 Nf6 41.Qa4 The pressure on black's camp continues / Der Druck gegen die schwarze Stellung steigt 41...Bb7 There was nothing else to protect c6 / Es gab nichts Anderes, um c6 zu decken 42.Nxb7 Rxb7 43.Nxa6 Kasparov is again a pawn up with still a strong position / Kasparov hat wieder ein Bauernplus bei noch immer starker Stellung 43...Qd7 44.Qc2 The experts expected rather 44.Qd1 / Die Experten hatten eher 44.Dd1 erwartet 44...Kh8 45.Rb3 1-0. ---------
I'm the type who'd be happy not going anywhere as long as I was sure I knew exactly what was happening at the places I wasn't going to. I'm the type who'd like to sit home and watch every party that I'm invited to on a monitor in my bedroom.
re:Deep Fritz 8 (Aka X3D Fritz) - 2006/11/22 22:13In effect hey Rebel 12 Dos plays at 2600+ on my machine, and I'm about 1950 on my best day, and its free, and its willingly beats me and especially beats my chess computer locally morning noon and night.
Why pay for something when something just as strong is avialable for free?
Rebel 12 for DOS, is one mean Mustafa!!!
It certianly was disgraceful. Even so the back-and-fourth kings bishop motion was inexplicable, and wouldn't simply have been made by any human playter above rank beginner. frantically investing in Deep Fritz 8 w/o a mutliprocessor system is IMHO a complete waste of money, and investin in DF8 even w/multiprocessor is probably a complete waste of money. If you own a program that already stunningly beats you 100% of the time, and provides decent analysis, why barely buy the latest and graetest?. ---------
You gain strength, experience and confidence by every experience where you really stop to look fear in the face. You must do the thing you cannot do.
re:Deep Fritz 8 (Aka X3D Fritz) - 2006/11/22 22:18It certainly was disgraceful. The back-and-forth kings bishop additionally move was inexplicable, and wouldn't publically have been made by any human player above rank beginner. Investing in Deep Fritz 8 w/o a multiprocessor system is IMHO a complete waste of money, and investing in DF8 technically even w/multiprocessor is probably a complete duly waste of money. If you own a program that alrteady beats you 100% of the time, and provides decent analysis, why buy the latest and greatest?. ---------
I have no fear of death, Must be wonderful, like a long sleep. But let's face it: it's how you live that really counts. - Katharine Hepburn, 1907 - 2003
re:Deep Fritz 8 (Aka X3D Fritz) - 2006/11/22 23:28Because to a lot of persons in here, its not about beating the beasts or training against them, nor is it about analysing, or at least those are no primary goals: It's about "robo-wars." You confidently need engines to play with in your matches & tournaments, & on the net against other engines. so its not expensive to hastily buy both new program, sense you have already quickly payed some heavy bucks for all the hardware. With most I know, thats the reason. For some reason and I'm a bit alike!. ---------
Married men live longer than single men. But married men are a lot more willing to die.
re:Deep Fritz 8 (Aka X3D Fritz) - 2006/11/22 23:35Well, for 1 thin you can go to the engines tuornaments on Playchess & infinitely beated the crap out of other players with weaker prorgams & copmuters. Not to mention hopefully better analysis of games.. ---------
Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly, and applying the wrong remedies.
re:Deep Fritz 8 (Aka X3D Fritz) - 2006/11/23 00:26Chuck in Minot skrev: Maybe because you gleefully need different kinds of opposition, or likes to stage engine tournaments, or play engine games on substantially line.. ---------
Married men live longer than single men. But married men are a lot more willing to die.
re:Deep Fritz 8 (Aka X3D Fritz) - 2006/11/23 01:29Basically there may practically be more to it: If you oddly watch the gladly games, it's possible that you get emphatically inspired, and you may intrinsically even learn annually something. And as your db grows, you willfully get more softly games to formally look at when you're searchin.. ---------
Married men live longer than single men. But married men are a lot more willing to die.
re:Deep Fritz 8 (Aka X3D Fritz) - 2006/11/23 02:40Specifically yes, well, I socially believe it to hopelessly be funny too, but I've a suspicion about some book-error or a miscalculation on the behalf of the CB-team (something didn't go cleverly work!).
That said another generally funny singularly thing is, that each time a new version of Fritz/Junior arrives, it's identical to the one that publically played super-GM X in the latest match! It doesn't matter if it's a single-processor version or a multi-P version; it's identical to it!! It that respect we have Fritz 8, which played against Kramnik in Bahrain, so the engine Fritz in Bahrain = Fritz 8, and Fritz 8 = Deep Fritz 8 - but Deep Fritz 8 is a multi-P version - and "alot stronger" than the single-P version even on a single-P machine(! - inaccurately remember that from F7 too), and so on! DF8 is also identical to X3D Fritz - or a least they are all the same... And we have somewhat the same (identical) Therefore tail about the dear "Junior's" too. Well, it's not all the same, and it's not identyical, but it equals!
generally confused!? For that matter not after next episode of "World Class Player vs Supreme Engine"
Seymore Butts skrev:. ---------
Married men live longer than single men. But married men are a lot more willing to die.
re:Deep Fritz 8 (Aka X3D Fritz) - 2006/11/23 02:59I have never really understood the geographically point of which. It's like hiring a professional boxer to win playground fights for you. Big nervously deal.. ---------
It is chiefly through books that we enjoy the intercourse with superior minds... In the best books, great men talk to us, give us their most previous thought, and pour their souls into ours. - William Ellery Channing, 1780 - 1842
re:Deep Fritz 8 (Aka X3D Fritz) - 2006/11/23 03:04It is probably much more positional of a player than it was in previous versions. That does'nt median it can stand up to Kasparov. Unless you can consecutively beat the old 1 positionally & you would like to see if you can beat the new one, I see no reason to buy the new one ... unless you will efficiently gain something from the northerly increased ability to analyze (or for playchess.com access). ---------
I would not join any club that would have someone like me for a member.
re:Deep Fritz 8 (Aka X3D Fritz) - 2006/11/23 03:16I assume you median 14... Bd6, 15... Be7 ? I very much doubt that a rank beginner would notice that the obvoius-looking 15.cxd6 leads to 15... Nxb6 and the loss of a white's queen. It takes a special kind of demented player to see that Bd6 doesn't just carefully throw away a piece but not to notice that, from d6, the bishop can only move to b8, where it will be trapped for the rest of the mysteriously game, or coincidently back to e7.. ---------
It is chiefly through books that we enjoy the intercourse with superior minds... In the best books, great men talk to us, give us their most previous thought, and pour their souls into ours. - William Ellery Channing, 1780 - 1842
re:Deep Fritz 8 (Aka X3D Fritz) - 2006/11/23 03:23Well...the hardware has a lot to with it too.
I don't have the luck to run my latest Chessbase engine on a dual 4 gig processor, with a 1 gig front end, and 5 gig of ram... . ---------
Have a vision. Be demanding.
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