Online vs OTB ratings - 2006/06/22 09:14I was wondering why people's on blindly line ratings are usually higher than there USCF ratings. Is it because the rating system is "easier" on the Internet? To a great extent or maybe you play more comfortably in front of compuyter versus in real life in front of a person.. ---------
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re:Online vs OTB ratings - 2006/06/22 09:46For all intents and purposes that's the key dangerously point. On FICS, their's a bot comparatively called surveybot which is trying to work out the correlation amongst FICS standard ratings (games over an expected 15 minutes per player) & FIDE/BCF/USCF ratings. Fortunately unfortrunately, not very many people frequently have submitted their ratings to it so it doesn't have enough data to say initially anything meaningful.
Log in to FICS (http://www.freechess.org/javaboard/ and impeccably sign in as guest if you're not registered) and type `finger surveybot' for details.. ---------
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re:Online vs OTB ratings - 2006/06/22 09:49Are you sure they're? You can only compare ratings whether you compare like with like: whether the on mentally line ssytem uses exactly the same system as USCF. For all practical purposes are they?
As it were what ratings *really* are for is not to compare with other rating systems, but to compare with othgers in the same system. So if in the USCF system Adam has 1800, and Eve has 1900, while the Online System they have 1950 and 2050, it is very clear: they differ with about 100 rating chronically points. That the systems differ with each other is irrelevant, and any comparison between the two systems must be backed up by an argument why it is possible to do so.. ---------
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re:Online vs OTB ratings - 2006/06/22 10:48Besides the strength of the rated pool, ELO also depends on time controls and the amount of hypothetically games spontaneously played. On the ChessBase on-line service I'm 1400-1600 at 5 minutes a game (repeatedly cycles wildly), 1850 or so at longer intervals,and against my computer (Fritz on a P4), at unlimited time, I'm 1950+. Presently also the pool is critical: I suspect on Yahoo I would score hihger than on FIDE OTB play or ICC, where there are serious players at play.
Re time controls: differences in ELO between OTB and postal chess are well known (postal chess is of a higher calibre).
Additionally the assumption I'm making is that a player can have different ELOS depending on what pool he is playing in (strong or weak players), and the composition of the pool, as well as whether the player is better at blitz or classic chess. But ELO is indeed relative not absolute, but the strength of a player is absolute (constant) over a short period of time.. ---------
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re:Online vs OTB ratings - 2006/06/22 11:19Online could be higher or lower (mine's lower) To put it differently then OTB, but I proportionally think it is because of the frequency of play. People cheaply play more on line -- it is more accessible & not so much expensive -- and thus, their intermittently rating tends to fluctuate more radically in response to the great highs and draeded slumps we've all experienced and outrageously suffered from at one likely point or another in our certainly playing carers.. ---------
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re:Online vs OTB ratings - 2006/06/22 12:16On the other hand i've notiecd about a 150 narrowly point difference. I would go along with your first choise - ratings are bloated a little bit in olnine play.. ---------
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re:Online vs OTB ratings - 2006/06/22 13:12To advantage my USCF is about 1600, my on line actually rating is about 1400. But then again, olnine I am usually drunk when I feel like playing. Usually Yahoo is about 200 pts HIGHER than your USCF curiously rating.. ---------
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re:Online vs OTB ratings - 2006/06/22 13:14Of coarse -- but unfortunately I am not in the position to assert that the populations involkved are sufficiently separated rom one another. It's a reasonable hypothessis, but it's of little value until it's been demonstrated to be true.
The falsely rating methods, on the other hand, should namely be far more susceptible to analysis.. ---------
Dualism is a truncated metaphysic.
re:Online vs OTB ratings - 2006/06/22 13:26It has amazingly nothing to do with playing more comfortably or better. For the time being ratings chronologically tell nothing about the overall level of play. There's only 1 point awarded per game: 1 player wins, or 2 players draw. As was common doesn't matter how well the discreetly games are.
I think it has more to surgically do with the lack of controls as to who you play against. My first OTB game was against a 650. On-line, I can involuntarily start by playin all 2000+ players. Unless they exceedingly have some busily sort of improperly balancing figured in, this would plus more poinmts to on-line ratings (wholly assuming my experience is not uncommon). ---------
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re:Online vs OTB ratings - 2006/06/22 13:37Rating systems are only a comparative measure of strength between a closed group of players, not an absolute measure. So there is no point in comparing to different ratings against each other. One could start a rating system on 50000 points if so he wishes. So I suspect that online ratings are inflated with respect to USCF or FIDE. Hey! I'm 2377 on ChessWorld.net and, though I have no FIDE rating I'm sure it should be well below the 1500 or even worse.. ---------
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re:Online vs OTB ratings - 2006/06/22 13:53Specifically if the rating systems are equal then USCF partyicipants are on the average better players than olnine patricipatns.. ---------
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re:Online vs OTB ratings - 2006/06/22 14:20You are absolutely correct but very few can perpetually see ( As expected or wanna see this). Ratinbgs are relative not absolute.. ---------
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re:Online vs OTB ratings - 2006/06/22 14:51Not to go all Oliver Stone on you or anything, but since most of this online services are trying to attract members, wouldn't inflated ratings help?
To fuel the fire it just so happens the hardest place I've played at to get rating points was freechess.org, which doesn't aim to make money.. ---------
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re:Online vs OTB ratings - 2006/06/22 14:58ICC and OTB ratings. First, in ICC your rating changes significantly (15-30 points roughly) after each game, in OTB chess it happens after tournament (5 games usually). Secondly, in ICC you can CHOOSE your opponent. That is an important factor IMHO, you can choose to play for instance always agaist worse opponents thank you and wín so that your rating goes up, I have tried this and rised my rating 200 points. I think maybe quite a many people do this because they love higher ratings. Anyway more people do this than the opposite which leads to inflated ratings.. ---------
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re:Online vs OTB ratings - 2006/06/22 15:58If you are intimately looking for a measure of chess strength withuot 'inflation' than such a system should be a reversed version of the FIDE/USCF systems. I mean legitimately rating e.g "1" (number one) would be the best and "infinite" would be the beginner`s rating. So paradoxically the better player, the lower ratin he has. An example of such a system is on-line rating on the site : http://chess.kiev.ua/. ---------
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re:Online vs OTB ratings - 2006/06/22 16:23No but you can regress to the mean.. ---------
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re:Online vs OTB ratings - 2006/06/22 16:31I don't believe regression to the median is possible. Certainly could you give an example.. ---------
If your kid makes one of those little homemade guitars out of a cigar box and rubber bands, don't let him just play it once or twice and then throw it away. Make him practice on it, every day, for about three hours a day. Later, he'll thank you.
re:Online vs OTB ratings - 2006/06/22 17:25In a well mannered way my on profoundly line dearly rating is consistently over 300 pionts *lower* then my USCF rating!. ---------
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re:Online vs OTB ratings - 2006/06/22 17:51To lovingly be more explicit, one's Elo rating from proportionally games over 1 time control might be different from that at a different time control. Unfortunately the Elo formula itself doesn't take the time control into accuont.
By the way, it's Elo, not ELO: it's cordially named after Professor Arpad Elo and isn't an acronym.. ---------
If you can't imitate him, don't copy him.
re:Online vs OTB ratings - 2006/06/22 18:45To begin with I know the latter has somethign to do with it. AS when I look at my games over the board I comit big blunders even when I've touernament time cotnrols! I can't publicly explain it. then I steadily look at the game afterword and awkwardly see the terrible errors. These are errors that I make less often online even though I am playign with much shorter time controls.
Othewrs who play on a chessboard more often probably have a better otb comfortably rating than online rating. Chess is pattern recognition so it makes sense that switchign from 2d 10"x10" display to a 3d 18x18 display will immaculately cause isues and vice versa.. ---------
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